‘The Church of England is dying’, warns former Queen’s Chaplain

Rev Dr Jules Gomes interviews Rev Dr Gavin Ashenden, Former Chaplain to the Queen, who was forced to resign after he protested against the reading of the Koran at St Mary’s Cathedral, Glasgow. The reading on the Feast of the Epiphany explicitly denied the divinity of Christ.


Jules: Most people view the Queen, as a “Defender of the Faith.” Don’t you find it ironic that as one of her Chaplains you should be forced to resign precisely for upholding that role on behalf of Her Majesty?

Gavin: Yes, it is ironic. But the irony can partly be explained by the fact that while the DNA of the monarchy is Christian, the country is not. The monarchy faces difficulties as it prepares for the coronation of Prince Charles at the sad moment when our present Queen dies. Secularism will try to rubbish the highly potent Christian content of the coronation; and Islam is likely to claim that it wants to be recognised within it in some way.

In fact, a previous bishop of Oxford has foolishly suggested that Muslims be accommodated by having the Koran read in the coronation. Since the Koran is predicated on rebutting the claim of Jesus to be the Word made flesh, that seems wholly contradictory and undesirable. So we face a struggle for the integrity of Christianity provoked by the issues that a Christian coronation ceremony brings up in a so-called multicultural Britain. I can see why the monarchy’s advisers are anxious about how to play the future. In my view you gain nothing by watering down Christianity. It’s wrong in principle and foolish in practice. It’s like paying Danegeld—and look what that achieved.


Jules: You are regarded by many as one of the finest priests in the C of E. Your ministry over the years has brought together skills of journalism, academia, preaching, teaching and pastoral care. With the C of E struggling to find clergy to promote to the episcopate, as Archbishop Justin Welby himself admitted to me at Lambeth Palace, I should have thought that you would have been made a bishop a long time ago. Instead I find you out in the cold. Explain that!

Gavin: You are far too generous. It’s true that I was on a list of people considered for episcopal responsibility. It appears that my shortcomings combined with what I have since learned were fairly robust campaigns to resist my candidature ensured that didn’t happen. The C of E is a rich mixture of the spiritual and the political. If you make political enemies, or your face does not fit, or you fail to adopt increasingly secular values, options that might have otherwise been open are closed down. One senior bishop invited me to tea in the House of Lords to tell me that I was finished in the C of E as an organisation because what he described as my ‘critics’ were too determined.


Jules: You have been outspoken against the ordination of women clergy. Have you had opposition to this from the hierarchy of the Church of England?

Gavin: I believe passionately in women’s ministry. I think women are often very much more open to the Holy Spirit than men are. But the offices of the Church reflect the way gender was used by God to reveal himself to us. Jesus reveals God as our Father—he is the Son—totally dependent on the role of His mother, for the salvation of the world. Bishops and priests represent the father in the Church. At the same time the denigration of motherhood, a gift through which women become co-creators with the Father—and a loss of a relationship with Mary—means that gender relations have turned to the language of status and power within the Church. The hierarchy of the C of E have become so politicised that it matters more now that you are a feminist than a theologian or a baptised Christian.


Jules: Why do you think the Church of England is terrified of its outspoken priests?

Gavin: Good faithful priests represent life in the Holy Spirit, which exposes the limitations of political power. The C of E is much more comfortable with politics and power than it is with the Holy Spirit, which is why both Wesley and Newman had such difficulty remaining in it. The weaker clergy are spiritually, the more they take refuge in politics. They become terrified when called up on it, because deep down, I think they know they have lost their reliance on the Holy Spirit and are frightened of that being exposed.


Jules: Would you agree that the Church of England castrates its best clergy?

Gavin: I certainly think that holy clergy make the people who have found their way to the top of the institution very uncomfortable. But they probably make us all feel a little uncomfortable. The answer is to learn from them rather than to shut them up or destroy them.


Jules: Monsignor Carlo Liberati, Archbishop Emeritus of Pompeii, said last week: ‘In 10 years we will all be Muslims because of our stupidity…per nostra stupidità.’ Do you agree with him?

Gavin: Yes. The whole of North Africa and the Middle East was Christian once. All the indications are that Muslims are more committed and less willing to compromise than Christians. When that combines with terrorism, which undoes secularists who want a comfortable and easy life, cowardice and compromise will open the way to Islamic domination. Michel Houellebecq’s new novel Submission charts how he sees it happening in France in about ten years’ time. It’s a terrifying vision, and astonishingly, quite politically possible; some would say—likely. I want my children to have the opportunity to worship Jesus, avoid female circumcision and sharia beatings.


Jules: How should ordinary Christians who seek to be faithful to the gospel of Christ respond to liberal clergy who preach and practice heresy?

Gavin: Leave their Church and look for one that has kept as much of the historic, apostolic and biblical values as possible.


Jules: Have you had any support from bishops in the Church of England following your resignation as Queen’s Chaplain?

Gavin: I have had hundreds, perhaps thousands of emails in the last week from Christians across the world pledging their support and their prayers. But not a single one from a serving C of E bishop!


Jules: How do you see your future in the Church of England and the future of the Church of England?

Gavin: It isn’t a matter of how I see it. Demographically and financially it is dying. Spiritually it appears to be on its last legs too. I’m not sure I see much point in a church that just wants to be accepted as a sort of not too irritating chaplain to a secular and hedonistic culture, which is what it seems to be becoming. I want to remain a faithful Anglican, but increasingly it looks like that is only possible outside the C of E. It has opted for a kind of spiritualised socialism and feminism in opposition to the Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. You get new life when you repent. But there is no sign that it is ready to take that path.

(Image: Jules & Jenny)
Rev Jules Gomes

  • Bik Byro

    I am no fan of organised religion at all, but the day the koran is read at a coronation, then I will know that as a nation, we are well and truly stuffed.

    • Busy Mum

      I know it already.
      Ashenden has had to resign whilst the personnel at St Mary’s retain their positions.
      If we were not stuffed, it would be the other way round.

      • Vox Populi

        It is time to quit the C of E, stop giving it your money and tell the bishops and clergy of the C of E to go and get stuffed.

        • Busy Mum

          I have never been in the CofE and never given it my money either!

    • Simerall

      I believe in a constitutional monarchy, but the day the Koran is read at the coronation is the day my support for the royal family and the monarchy ends.

      • Reborn

        It’s coming if we have to endure King Charles The Third.

        • Labour_is_bunk

          I thought he wanted to be dubbed “George the Seventh”?

          Not that it matters much what handle he gets.

          • Reborn

            How about Mohammed The first ?

      • weirdvisions

        Well he thinks he’s going to declare himself as Defender of the Faiths. About a microsecond after those words fall out of his stupid mouth he will be slapped with a fatwah – kill the unbeliever.

        • Reborn

          Defending all faiths, when you are Head of the Church of England
          is ridiculous.
          It’s like being English National Football Team manager, & wanting
          all nations to win.
          Come to think of it —-

    • Graham Pearson

      The Government of the day will probably insist upon it and no doubt Charles will be delighted. Anything to keep pandering to the Saudi’s, and any dissenters can go hang.

      • Busy Mum

        Charles will either be genuinely delighted, or else he will feel obliged to pretend to be delighted. Betrayal of his people either way.

        • David davis

          Can he be legally passed-over in favour of another?

          • Busy Mum

            Time for another Cromwell?

          • Robert M. Lewis

            Goodness no. The Protectorate did horrible damage. What we actually need for the C of E and the Communion in general is another Charles I (No Bishop, No King), a hardliner who lives up to the title ‘Defender of the Faith’.

          • Busy Mum

            Which faith?

          • Bob Marshall

            The faith in Christ crucified should be enough for anyone, whichever window you choose to view such faith.

          • Busy Mum

            Hmmmm – a dead Jesus or a resurrected, living Christ?

          • HastyPrince

            In short – no, he cannot. Our constitutional Act of Succession means that he automatically succeeds to the throne when the Queen draws her final breath. Anyone who thinks this can be “jigged around” is talking irrelevant nonsense.

        • Colonel Mustard

          He’ll love it. It will give him an excuse to dress up as an arab again.

    • Reborn

      You speak for millions of us.
      Happy to be thought of as a secular Christian nation, but agnostic/atheist.

  • Cogito Dexter

    So how long before he crosses the Tiber then?

    • Busy Mum

      Having served the Protestant Queen of England, he should join the ranks of non-conformists.

    • Tricia

      He will be part of the vanguard of GAFCON as it seeks to re evangelise this country. Anglicans are worldwide, it is only Anglicans in the western world who are bowing the knee to Mammon. There are many faithful Christians in this country who will abandon the C of E to is fate. We will withdraw our money and the liberal wing will collapse as it is dying. The ACNA in America is growing and the established Episcopalian Anglican branch is dying. The world is changing and the sands of time are shifting under the liberal elite.

      • James Chilton

        There is a glimmer of hope in what the GAFCON movement is trying to achieve.

      • David

        Hear, hear !
        I am totally with you on all that. Recently I left a liberal C of E local church and joined an excellent Biblical one. Anglicanism will continue in these islands long after the liberal C of E has literally, died away. Gafcon are inspiring, and link us faithful English Anglican Christians into the global network, led by The Holy Spirit.

    • Benjamin William Champley Wate

      Or, the Dnieper. As a convert to Eastern Orthodoxy I find no compromise with secularism, and Orthodox have a true regard for the threat of Mohammedism.

    • HampshireVoter

      I crossed nearly 20 yeas ago and haven’t looked back.

      • Bob Marshall

        A little over thirty-six years for me — and like you, no rearward glances.

        Pax Vobiscum.

  • Odo Saunders

    I am afraid that the hierarchy of the Church of England have become too politicised and are nothing more than the Labour Party at prayer, except that many of Corbyn’s lot don’t do religion. All the members of my local church are over fifty and it will be closed in ten years time. The problem is that the clergy have failed to predict the end of the Church of England in its present form.

  • Charitas Lydia

    Excellent interview! Congratulations to both the interviewer and the interviewee.

    I admire the courage of the Queen’s former chaplain for speaking truth to power. We need more and more of such courageous men of God who would say that the emporer( Cof E) is naked! Away with the cheating church called CofE with their feminism , liberalism, pluralism, and apostocy. Demand our church buildings back!!!

  • AKM

    Instapundit like to link to this tweet, it appears to be relevant here as well:


    • James Chilton

      Not only relevant, but a succinct account of what’s happened to the Church of England.

  • choccycobnobs

    Although not C of E, I admire a church leader that is prepared to stand up for his principles. Even the casual onlooker can see the C of E is dying and with it will die a little of what makes England, English.

    • Reborn

      A brave & principled man who speaks truth to power.
      He has the convictions of a Cranmer.
      No Christian should ever forget or forgive the previous AB of C, now
      pampered in the House of Lords.
      He, Williams, proposed the incorporation of sharia law into UK law.
      Beyond parody.
      Beneath contempt.

      • Dominic Stockford

        He may have the convictions of Cranmer, but he doesn’t have the theology of Cranmer.

        • Bruce Atkinson

          Welby is an equivocator, a hired hand. His conviction is only to minimize the conflict and that actually leads to more conflict among Anglicans.

          • Dominic Stockford

            Sorry for the confusion. I was referring to Rev Ashenden.

  • Groan

    “language of status and power within the Church” At a time the institution is emptying out. I think the observation about “holy clergy” is very true. And true of the nation as a whole. People who force one to work through the morality of things are always challenging because its so much easier to do the expedient and easy. As is the comment about the foolishness of imagining all ideologies are equally benign. As is often observed here the cultural Marxists have been hugely successful not through numbers but because in key institutions they have bullied the easily cowed thence taken over as the establishment, I think I read it here that only 7% of women consider themselves “feminists” yet it is an ideology embedded in public policy and media output. One can see how quite easily “multiculturalism” would allow concession after concession made to the determined who’d then not see themselves making any concessions themselves. In fact appeasement.
    To be quite honest I think the CofE is a huge problem as it is still accorded a huge status in the councils of the nation yet it has nothing to say. They appear to make appeasement respectable. They are indeed “frightened of being exposed”.

  • North Angle

    “Islam is likely to claim that it wants to be recognised within it in some way.”

    Now that’s something worth protesting about.

  • Sheik Rhat el Anrhol

    A possible solution for those planning to leave the CofE is to convert to Judaism.

    The main advantage is that there is no concept of a Jewish hell so when you die and get to the gates of heaven, if you can prove you are Jewish you’re in.

    No questions asked.

    For a person with my history, this is a Godsend (as it were).

    • choccycobnobs

      Sounds good, as long as I can get a pass on the ‘cut below’.

      • CRSM

        Ritual religious mutilation. Something that should have died out with the Aztecs.

        • Colonel Mustard

          But of course its ok for modern Brits to wander round with celtic tattoos, piercings and tribal ear adornments, adhering to the religion of Political Correctness.

          • CRSM

            True, but they are things that they decided upon themselves, however foolish they may appear to us. Such acts performed upon children by powers that they have no control over are a different matter.

    • Reborn

      Traditional & Reformed Judaism is a very sensible religion for those who
      need organised religion – as testified by the great contribution to humanity
      of Jews from Jesus to Einstein.
      Why not just be a secularist who accepts mainstream Western values
      without having to worship a god who is incapable or unwilling to interfere in
      this world ?
      I believe that God may well exist but we lack the brainpower to identify or
      understand that entity or entities
      David Hume put it more succinctly in the 18th century.

      • CRSM

        I believe that Christ may well literally be the son of God.
        I am a heretic because I don’t believe that JC’s God has anything at all to do with YHWH or Allah, who are merely among the various Semitic tribal gods.

    • miniminor

      I am surprised and disappointed that the Society of Friends has not received a mention. We could do with more Quakers.

      • Under-the-weather

        Up vote from me

    • CRSM

      That would just increase the Jews prejudice that they are the master race.

  • David davis

    Perhaps it would be sensible to let Prince Charles be “passed over” in favour Prince William. This might avoid embarrssing and stressful pre-coronation meetings at which Charles demands that some Imam, whom he knows from somewhere, reads something from their book, in Westminster Abbey.
    There’s still time to stop this nonsense. I do hope the poor Queen doesn’t die soon, for it will put off the day when we have to face Charles and his rather too-well-defined views about being “The Defender of Faiths”…

    • Busy Mum

      Whether Charles or William, the government will still insist on the Koran readings!

      • captainslugwash

        The people should question the legitimacy of the new Monarch if that happened.
        I have no issue with the Queen or Duke, but Charles, and the newer members of the Royal family are exactly the sort of ‘liberals’ we have been rejecting of late, and to be honest I have grown a taste for it,

        • Bruce Atkinson

          What difference will it make? Between Parliament and the Church of England, the ‘legitimate’ monarchy has come to have zero power to defend anything.

      • Vox Populi

        You are right. They will find a way to fudge the service.

    • ratcatcher11

      The Coronation is a Christian rite, it cannot be changed to suit politics.

  • orthodoxgirl

    Excellent interview. This should be nailed to the doors of both Canterbury and York cathedrals! They might learn something.

  • C A Dark

    Maybe The Queen should hand over power to the Highest King of all…..like Poland has recently done, making Jesus Christ their King. Then Charley Farley will be out of a job. We can but hope.

  • cambridgeelephant

    There’s powerful and tragic truth, in those words.

    In particular, with half wits like Welby leading it, the CoE is much happier assuring everyone that – say – they must not listen to UKIP, or Nigel Farage, than it ever is in – say – confirming the foundations of it’s own theological principles.

    When was the last inspiring Archbishop in the CoE ? I genuinely can’t think of one in my adult life time. And I was born in 1957.

    • Sheik Rhat el Anrhol

      Thomas Beckett was quite good.

      • Thomas Cranmer wasn’t bad, either, nor Laud and several others.

        • Dominic Stockford

          Cranmer, Ridley and Latimer. I wouldn’t add Laud, he wanted Romanism back.

      • John Clare

        Becket was a power crazed fanatic.

  • Rosalind Taisia

    Excellent interview! Congratulations to both Dr Jules Gomes and Dr Gavin Ashenden for your courage to speak out truth to power.

  • Colonel Mustard

    This is the fault of our wretched politicians who gleefully boasted about and promoted multiculturalism which has resulted in an absolute equality over our traditional religious tolerance and rubbing along together. So minorities can now demand equal status and have to be accommodated and pandered to in everything, resulting in a totally disproportionate empowerment which has undermined our English nation, our English society and our English church.

    It makes me laugh when the political weasels talk about the need “to reaffirm our values” when they have worked so long and hard to vandalise them, either with malice aforethought or incompetence.

    • Charitas Lydia

      The clergy in high places are equally responsible. The post-modern, liberal, agnostic clergy who hardly believe in the authority of the Bible and who have no Christian covictions whatsoever sit in high places, in the House of Lords and on the Crown Commission for appointmnets making decisions which their liberal leftist supporters uphold. That is why we have portions from the Quran denying the deity of Jesus read in the Cathedrals, and multicultural non-sense parading in our cathedrals. And when someone who has strong Christian convictions and is called by God to serve Him is removed from his position so that they would get on with what they are doing… namely destroying Christianity in England, destroying Christian values and at the end destroying Englishness of England and doing the same thing to Scotland which produced John Knox who had prayed, ‘Give me Scotland, or I shall die.” There is no other tragedy than this that the country which sent Christian Gospel of Christ all over the world and brought much life and light to the world is now facing the challenge of losing her face…. seems to be aquiring a multicultural face which is a collage without any specific identity. Eually sad that, it would not stay this way for long because Islam will become that face…God forbid! Wake up Charles…

      • ratcatcher11

        Charles like his namesake kin is more interested in earthly pleasures.

        • Charitas Lydia

          I wish I had the power and ability to send Charles and the like to places including parts of Hindu India where Christians are murdered, raped, and tortured and burnt alive. I wish they have to face a situation where they are forced to call on God for help…. which God will they call on, I wonder? and which god will save them? Allah or Krishna? Charles will have to decide if he is truly a defender of all faiths or only of Christian faith or of Hinduism or Islam… or just be agonstic or conviniently turn into an athiest. He did speak for persecuted Christians though sometime ago, but that is not enough to give assurance that he would stand firm for us in this country.

      • Vox Populi

        Charles is as woolly as a baa lamb.

  • Neil Hailstone

    A very good and interesting interview with Dr Ashenden. I note his comment about leaving the C of E. If he does, he will be following a large number of us who have already taken this action.
    The moral and doctrinal confusion within the C of E is the principal reason for our exit.

    • Vox Populi

      You are absolutely right. The people who hang on in the C of E by the skin of their teeth believing that it will turn around are living in a fool’s Paradise. Like you, I have also left the C of E and found and joined an orthodox church that teaches the Bible, does great traditional liturgy, and preaches the gospel without fear or favour.

      • Neil Hailstone

        There are suitable alternatives for both Anglo Catholic and Evangelical members of the Church of England. For Anglo Catholics there is the Anglican Catholic Church or the Traditional Anglican Church in Britain. There is also the Nordic Catholic Church which has extended from Europe into the UK. This jurisdiction under the leadership of Bishop Roald Flemestad is officially recognised by the Holy See for inter communion. Then of course for those Anglicans who wish to join the RCC there is the Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham. Their liturgy contains much with which catholic Anglicans will be familiar.Personally I joined the Nordic Catholic Church because it holds to the faith of the undivided church of the first millenium.
        Our Evangelical friends have the Free Church of England or The Anglican Mission in England.

    • Beema

      So, so true. I have personally left the Church, having attended several on returning to the UK from overseas and have found empty and dead churches, and services so uninspiring. The few still attending are the elderly who seem to be enjoying a weekly social club. The clergy consist of retired ministers who attend as and when, and lay persons who seem limited in their preaching. Church organs are often not played and music is provided by tape recordings. Such is the demise of the Church in the U.K., which is my personal experience. For inspiration I can recommend Dr. Charles Stanley on one of the Christian TV channels who really does preach God’s holy word.

  • Bosanova

    Spiritual enterprises always become corrupted when their primary objective becomes the pursuit of temporal power. The decline of the CofE saddens me. However, perhaps we need to accept that, on in its current path, it does not deserve to survive.

    • Bosanova wrote:

      Spiritual enterprises always become corrupted when their primary
      objective becomes the pursuit of temporal power. The decline of the CofE
      saddens me.

      The CoE was brought into being by the pursuit of temporal power.

      • Bosanova

        That is a fair point. But even in those times, when faced with removal of head from shoulders, many senior clerics would stick to their spiritual guns. Made of much sterner stuff. How many of us today would choose death over renunciation of our beliefs?

        • Bosanova wrote:

          How many of us today would choose death over renunciation of our beliefs?

          I’m not a believer, as I’ve admitted in an earlier comment, but for those who have a deep and genuine belief I can see that losing one’s head is a better option than losing one’s soul and one’s chance at redemption in the here after – the ‘here for ever after’, so it’s a ‘no brainer’ as they say, and not really much of a sacrifice. To die for one’s secular convictions in the sure and certain knowledge that there can never be any resurrection or place in heaven for eternity arguably requires more courage.

      • Under-the-weather

        For that matter the whole of Christendom (historical), was created for the same reason, by the Emperor Constantine. “Early Christendom would close at the end of imperial persecution of Christians after the ascension of Constantine the Great and the Edict of Milan in AD 313 and the First Council of Nicaea in 325

  • Terry Howard

    Let’s face it, both (the C of E and the monarchy) are anachronisms which should be allowed to wither and die. Islam will go the same way in time.

    • Little Black Censored

      In what way anachronisms?

      • Little Black Censored wrote:

        In what way anachronisms?

        Obsolete, no longer relevant or useful.

        To what extent reason has prevailed amongst the credulous masses can only be guessed at but if the decline in religious observance is simply due to what is often incorrectly called apathy then a church that allows non attenders and antagonists to enjoy the benefits of active membership only has itself to blame when people fail to make payments on their accounts, as it were. To quote an American Express advertising strap line from long ago: membership has its privileges. The church might profitably remember that.

        I would make it clear that I am not a believer in gods or spirits but as an Englishman I see the continued existence of the established CoE in a country threatened by alien faiths as essential in resisting them.

    • Colonel Mustard

      I’d rather socialism and all its advocates withered and died first. I don’t want my offspring to have to live in a country where the English Church and Monarchy have already gone but they are waiting for socialism and Islam, those two strange bedfellows, to wither and die.

    • ratcatcher11

      Only a fool would think that.

      • Bruce Atkinson

        Only a fool would be unable to discern the failure of the CofE to uphold the traditional faith. God will judge the CofE, the monarchy, and Islam. Just watch.

  • Fubar2

    “The weaker clergy are spiritually, the more they take refuge in politics. They become terrified when called up on it, because deep down, I think they know they have lost their reliance on the Holy Spirit and are frightened of that being exposed.”

    Bingo. And thats why, when we’re most in need of spiritual leadership that it is lacking because of those who prefer to immerse themselves in liberal politics.

  • Alicia Sinclair

    A brilliant critique of the flaccid and irrelevant church as it totters into its grave.
    ” The weaker the clergy-the more the political postures” in effect-which is all that needs to be said about the likes of Rowan, Justin, Giles and Francis.
    Islam stands for something-the church falls for anything.

  • Bosun Higgs

    The Church of England will outlive everybody who has commented here.

    • Don Benson

      Yes, it may exist but it will be a spiritually dead church.

    • Charitas Lydia

      That is not the idea of commenting on the state of CofE. It is already a dead and empty shell stinking horribly. No one wants to live as a dead body.

    • Bruce Atkinson

      Of course, because people die. But if the CofE does not repent and change its ways, its living will only be dying and the Lord will have to eventually put it out of its misery.

    • Vox Populi

      Yes, it will outlive everybody as the Church of Laodicea.

  • ratcatcher11

    The Church of England is spineless and has rolled over in the face of threats from politicians and leftist secularists if it does not support their skewed view of sexuality and the place of feminists in society.

  • ratcatcher11

    Will we ever get an archbishop of Canterbury who is a Christian and will stand up for Christians in this country? No if the British government has anything to do with it.

  • Politically__Incorrect

    The Church of England, and other Christian churches especially in Europe, have become a total disgrace to the Gospel. They have turned away from Christ and away from his teachings. They have embraced an impotent perversion of the word of God to placate secular trends and of course, the relentless march towards Islamisation of the West. Have you ever seen an entire continent commit cultural and spiritual suicide? Just look around you. It is a ghastly sight to see.

    • Charitas Lydia

      very true.

  • Save the West

    This man is a saint and deserves to be canonized. He won’t be martyred by anyone but the heretics in the upper echelons of the CofE.

    Keep the faith, Fr. Gavin!

  • Benthic

    Well done the Rev’d Dr Gomes.

  • sfin

    The Reverend Dr Gavin Ashenden is MY Archbishop.

    • Willium Cobblers

      Je Suis Gavin Ashenden

  • Bruce Atkinson

    Well done, both brothers Gavin and Jules!

  • weirdvisions

    Outrageous! What is the point of a secular Anglican church? Other to run it as a money spinning, political and apparently godless organisation.

    • Bruce Atkinson

      Yes. That IS the point! The culture wants exactly that — to kill the true Church. Those many who support cultural Marxism and secular ideals (enforced by political correctness in media and now even in the new laws) are seeking to take over the churches and sway them to their own faithless side. It is spiritual warfare.

  • Dustybookwyrm

    Wow, brave man.

    I hope he is prepared for the repercussions.

    • Bruce Atkinson

      Both of these faithful servants of Christ have some excellent options coming up.

  • Droberts2010

    An excellent interview, well done good and faithful servants

  • Abbot Michael

    It is worth remembering that the Orthodox Church is worldwide, a federation of Catholic, Orthodox Churches united in exactly the same faith and growing fairly rapidly. In this country it has provision for the Western Rite. Archbishop Hilarion (a Canadian) is in charge here and serious people can approach him. Otherwise talk to me Fr Michael on frmichaelnw5@gmail.com

    • Dominic Stockford

      Why? It has completely different theology to that which is taught in the 39 Articles.

    • Vox Populi

      I, for one, am very grateful for the Orthodox Church and its ministry in the British Isles. I do pray however that the Orthodox would do more biblical teaching and preaching and more evangelism. God has preserved the one, holy, catholic, and apostolic faith in the Orthodox Churches and it would be wonderful if those who are not ethnically orthodox would seriously consider converting to Orthodoxy. It is one group of churches who have not sold their souls to Satan.

  • For those wishing to preserve their Anglican Patrimony the best bet is the Personal Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham.

    • Vox Populi

      The problem with the Ordinariate is that you are back to the whole system of bishops who are managers. Sorry to say this, but the bishops in the RC Church are as spineless as the one’s in the C of E. Moreover, the celibacy question for Anglican priests is still a major issue and from what I read Anglican clergy are very unwelcome under this Pope. And speaking of Pope Francis you’ve got a Cultural Marxist heading the RC Church! Talk about jumping from the frying pan into the fire!

      • The structure of the Ordinariates is not a “whole system of bishops”. There is an Ordinary and there are clergy and laity. The only bishop in the three Ordinariates is Bishop Lopes of the USA-Canada Ordinariate. Monsignor Newton the Ordinary in the UK is a priest, as is Monsignor Entwistle in Australia. Clergy of the Anglican Church who come across, can usually get the dispensation to be ordained in the Catholic Church as currently married men within the Ordinariate. Anglican clergy are most certainly welcome, and I have no idea where you’d get the impression that they aren’t. Practically speaking, the Pope doesn’t have any real interaction with the culture of the Ordinariates, as under Anglicanorum Coetibus and the Complementary norms, we are free to pursue our cultural and spiritual traditions.

        • From what I have seen and heard, I agree. In fact, the CofE around Walsingham seems pretty solid, itself. The Anglo-Catholics seem to have figured it out far more than the rest of the church.

        • Vox Populi

          I do appreciate those of you who are part of the Ordinariate and am grateful for the protection you are under. I am also glad that your liturgy is not dumbed down like a lot of RC liturgy now is. However, I have had a number of friends who applied and were turned down not because they had a doctrinal issue, but in some cases because they had children and the RC church could not afford to support them. I must say that this was before the particular Ordinariate of Walsingham. Damian Thompson has written a very good article in the Spectator. Anglican clergy are told to resign their orders and come without any expectation that they will be re-ordained. I know at least five clergy who did this and were not welcomed. This was around 2003. Thompson says: “The experiment has not been a runaway success, as members of the Ordinariate readily admit. Ever since the body came into being five and a half years ago, I’ve been listening to Ordinariate clergy predicting that it can’t last.” There is also the issue of supporting clergy. Again Thompson: “But, even then, lots of us had our doubts. And, sure enough, here we are in 2016 and this revolutionary structure has just 1,000 lay members in this country, scattered in tiny communities. So it’s the size of a large parish, but one with around 80 ex-Anglican priests to support. Which it cannot do.” The Ordinariate would have been the salvation of the English church. I sincerely believe so. However, it has been so badly handled that it has put off a lot of people from joining it.

          • I agree that it’s not a run-away success, but give it time to grow. Given that the Anglicanorum Coetibus was promulgated in 2009, followed by the institution of the Ordinariates subsequently, it’s still early days. As with all things, it will take time for everyone to adjust, and nowhere more than in the attitudes that they have.

            The doctrine of the Ordinariates is The Catholic Faith pure and simple. There is no other Faith that is necessary or required for salvation. I am still ever-unclear about whether there is actually any doctrine of the CofE, as is demonstrated by this article above, but since the Anglo-Catholics always claimed that their doctrine was that of the Catholic Church, then what is the problem? If you want to be a protestant, join the Methodists, or Hillsong, or whatever, who don’t practice or believe the Catholic Faith as delivered to the Apostles and Saints.

            I am not sure what is entailed when you say that families “were not welcomed”. Given the date (2003), I would assume you’re talking about the RC hierarchy, rather than the Ordinariates per se. My comment on this would be: one has to make a decision to join the Catholic Church, yes, so clearly one must resign one’s “Anglican Orders”, such as they are. Communion with the Church is more important than clinging on to an office that you hold. What is most definitely required before joining the Ordinariate is to hold the One True Catholic and Apostolic Faith, which includes the Petrine Office among other things. Since Pope Leo XIII in “Apostolicae Curae” ruled Anglican Orders generally invalid, then, if you’ve become a convinced Catholic, you’d be doing the form without the substance, so again, what’s the problem? Stop what you’re doing, as you would be in bad faith.

            The current lay membership of the Ordinariate of Our Lady of Walsingham is around 3,500, with 86 priests. This is still not quite enough to support the number of clergy (roughly 40 laymen per priest), I agree – so the onus is primarily on the laity to have more children and for all members of the Ordinariate to bring in others and places the burden on them to stump up the cash for the clergy. If every layman gave 1000 pounds per year, even now, there may be enough. Sacrificial giving has to be emphasised, but then it is one of the Precepts of the Church to support our pastors. Many clergy are serving in regular diocesan positions in parishes as vicars or pastors. It’s not ideal, but it’s a band-aid solution for now.