Reader’s comment: A nation trashed

In response to Andrew Cadman: The great migration debate? Where’s it hiding?, Damaris Tighe wrote:

'Net migration' (resulting in population churn – great phrase, Andrew) is a deliberate deceit in which if 1,000 native Brits leave and 1,000 Kashmiri villagers arrive, nothing is deemed to have happened.
But of course something has happened and our society and culture will pay for it. Britain will become increasingly a patchwork of tribes ('communities'), united only by paper citizenship, who find the way of life of other tribes incomprehensible and disgusting. The nation forged over a thousand years into a people linked by history, language and mores will have been wilfully trashed. Once lost it's difficult to regain.
I'm descended from central European immigrants, adopted into the British people.They became more British than the British. My forefathers would weep to see the fragmentation of the core British nation which provided the culture and norms for them to assimilate to.




  • Phil R

    If you go to many of the Welsh towns you will see remnants of the old walls and remnants of old lawmaking bodies with jails underneath as for example in Laugharne.

    I have given up on national government and even the Assembly is just a more expensive and more left wing version of Westminster.

    The way forward is smaller government, a patchwork of tribes, with laws increasingly made locally and enforced locally.

    For once I am with the Muslims on this. I see it as the only way to push back the tide of police enforced sewage, that we are all increasingly forced to conform, to eat, and to say it smells and tastes lovely.

    • David R

      See my reply to this three hours ago.

  • David R

    Phil:
    All very well in theory, but what of the problems this would cause in the modern world where travel is easy and quick? I am reminded of the fourteen year old who brought his moped from his native France on the ferry and was told that it was illegal for him to ride it in Dover because of his age and lack of a crash helmet. If every set of local laws were passed separately by the local autority then how could anything national function,like a health service, education, defence and so forth. A practical example of this today is that people who live in certain areas list their home address at the doctor’s surgery as being in the Welsh half of town to avoid paying prescription charges (Knighton) and I gather some Scots are officially moving to Enland to avoid the SNP’s income tax.

    • You need to click “reply” on Phil comment, otherwise he will not get notification of your reply.

      • David R

        Sorry, my carelessness.

    • Phil R

      You have just described in a nutshell the EUs argument, why we all must conform and why we cannot have our own laws and certainly not freedom

      • David R

        That would be true if we wanted to live in a European superstate and my reason for voting leave was that there is no democratically elected bicameral legislature which creates laws for such a state or any sign of one being formed. All it has is a Commission (which is a retirement home for senior civil servants supervised by retired politicians) issuing “Directives”.which have the force of law. In fact an embryo Fourth Reich.

        • And all very well in practice as well. We’ve done the bifurcated law thing in the US for well over two hundred years, and still today most of our laws (especially the proper, objective ones) are state law, What it really takes are people who have enough sense to keep laws sensible, and erect a proper framework. That is certainly not the EU. Reference the kid with the moped, so what, why didn’t he realize that, that’s on him, ignorance is no excuse, ever.

          • therealguyfaux ✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            It helps to have a Tenth Amendment saying so, i.e., “All that which the US Constitution does not specifically reserve just to the Federal Government is left to the States,” but even there you had the Supreme Court in the 1930’s, after an initial reluctance, saying in effect, “Oh, what the heck, EVERYTHING is ‘interstate commerce’, we guess?” [i.e., something that is Federal jurisdiction], which tended to hollow out the 10A and allow all sorts of New Deal legislation.

          • Agreed, it’s very silly to consider grain grown for your own chickens to be interstate commerce. Maybe someday we’ll get back to where we should be, FDR did a lot of harm, I always wonder where we’d be if somebody like Coolidge replaced Hoover. 9th and 10th Amendments are almost dead letter law, and need to be revived. No doubt it would help if we repealed the 17th.

          • therealguyfaux ✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ

            You are of course referencing Wickard v. Filburn, and the “Kant Categorical Imperative” of “You cannot possibly want EVERYONE to be able to do such a thing as it would completely disrupt our whole national commodities trading, storage and distribution systems– i.e., it would disrupt interstate commerce!– which is why the Ag Department regulations are necessary and proper and comport with procedural due process of notice and comment, and are within the purview of the authority to issue such regs which was in the legislation giving such executive order authority to the Ag Sec.”

            This has more than the faint odour of the sort of mindset that produces and promulgates EU regs. The regs in W. v. F. were rendered a dead letter by WWII and were not re-imposed afterwards, but the ratio decidendi of the case has never been overruled.

          • I am, and precisely. It reeks of them, and many of ours as well. In passing, I grew up in Indiana, and my dad knew Wickard from business. He never referred to him as anything but, ‘That damned chicken farmer.” And yet dad was a New Dealer.

  • Ed McA

    …….and since the Pleistocene Ice Age mirants have continuously arrived in the British Isles so we are all migrants or offspring of migrants but the problem today is the phenomenal rate and then we have the dumb media wondering why there is pressure on welfare, NHS, translation services, education, housing etc.

    • Owen_Morgan

      The dumb media don’t need welfare, can afford extortionate housing prices, don’t use the NHS, if they can possibly avoid it, and protest that they really are state-educated, because they went to Oxford, or the LSE. Remember the wails that went up from the Beebyanka, when people were told they were expected to move oop north, to work in Salford. For the Beeboids, anything state-controlled is sacred, except for the armed forces, but they want as little actual contact as possible with the reality of it.

      • William

        Beebyanka – I see what you did there. Nice.

    • JabbaPapa

      Some recent research has been suggesting that this Ice Age left Britain uninhabited, as the inhabitants either died out from the climate change or (far more likely IMO) emigrated to more southerly climes.

    • David

      The Cheddar Gorge research points to a very stable population since the end of the last ice age. Invaders afterwards were, statistically, insignificant. All that changed dramatically of course post – WW2 due to socialist politicians – which includes the so called “Conservatives”.

      • Ed McA

        What do you mean by a very stable population?
        Do you mean numbers or genetics or what?
        Your word ”invaders” is pretty dramatic but many arrived possibly peacefully but no one really knows! The fact is that even small numbers of in-migrants made a big change as the post Pleistocene population was tiny. There were clearly arrivals as shown by the various developments from Palaeolithic peoples, through Mesolithic, Neolithic, Bronze Age, Iron Age, Romans, Dark Ages, Anglo-Saxons, Vikings, Normans ……………………………………..
        Hence I don’t understand ”stable” because, as stated before, tiny in-migrant numbers could have a dramatic effect on a small population.

        • David

          As the ice sheets retreated the hunters, who became the early island dwellers, moved northwards. Rising sea levels then cut them off. Genetically a tiny group, of perhaps just a few thousand became the stable population from which England’s population was largely formed. Subsequent arrivals Vikings, Normans and Huguenots etc made a relatively small impact on that genetically homogeneous population. Read up the Cheddar project. Genetics has shown us just how stable genetically our population was. It is of course essentially a matter of statistics, and relative change, as no population can remain unchanged totally, that’s not the point !

          • JabbaPapa

            You’re not fully appreciating, perhaps, the fact that during the period in question, Britain was part of continental Europe, and the Thames was a tributary river of the Rhine.

            It is probably impossible to determine which cultural heartland those first late Ice Age settlers belonged to, simply because several hypotheses could involve lands that no longer exist.

            Also, Northern Europeans generally, and Southern Europeans to a lesser but still meaningful degree, are typically descended from the Yamnaya people who colonised Northern Europe especially around 5000 years ago. They are the original whites. The earlier Europeans that ended up sharing Europe with these newcomers were shorter, paler or darker olive-skinned, and dark-haired (long straight hair, not African or semitic type), as some Welsh are to this very day. (Some old Greek traditional histories seem to suggest this this invasion was unstoppable, but that it led to peaceful coexistence rather than genocide)

            What genetics has shown is that some local populations are of very ancient origin, and also that the genetic make-up of the British Isles is consistent with the end result of the displacement of “the British” westwards by the invading Danes. Oh, and that the Norse and Norman/French genetic element in the population is tiny compared to the influence of the Yamnaya peoples, and the Romans, and Danes.

          • David

            Agree with the broad thrust of that.

  • Certainly it is clear that many native British are leaving for pastures new, mainly in the so-called “Anglosphere”. The more people that I speak to locally, the more I find who have children or grandchildren who have emigrated. These will be well educated people, the very people we need here.
    My younger daughter and her husband are seriously considering Australia as they have relations there. The main motivator is that a cousin’s son who is the same age as their own appears to be at least a year, if not more, ahead in his education which seems to be far less politically correct than here.

    • Decision_At_Sundown

      New Zealand or Texas. I seen pictures of London today that look no different to the crowd scenes we just saw in ZIMBABWE!

      • Very few “real” Londoners are left. Most have had the sense, like myself, to move out. My personal choice of a place abroad, were I younger, would be Vancouver.

  • Timmy

    Yank here. I work with a Brit expat. He is working to become a US citizen. Get his girlfriend out. He told me that the UK is a “sinking ship”. He said if he went back he would never go to a major city. Too much crime.

    The UK brought civilization to most of the world, ended the American slave trade, traded blood for world freedom in two world wars. Magna Carta. Tolkien. Shakespeare. King Arthur. Science, culture, great ideas.

    Now you are praying that a future king becomes gay. That giving a gal a peck on the cheek under mistletoe is rape, the royal navy has no aircraft carrier. You throw acid in people’s faces. You want to ban kitchen knives. Your own Olympic pistol team can’t practice in own your country.

    With respect, what happened to you? What happened?

    • Colonel Mustard

      Common Purpose mainly.

      • Timmy

        Sorry, what does that mean?

        • John Rollins

          Their the liberal/left mafia. Google it.

        • Colonel Mustard

          The “intellectual” and incestuous communist fifth column which when the Cold War ended morphed from aiding and abetting the Soviet Union to neuro-linguistically programming the once impartial civil service to become “leaders leading beyond (their) authority”. All dressed up as a form of benign “management training”. Set up as a “charity”, but no one knows how or why they successfully secured the monopoly contract for brainwashing the entire British establishment.

          These are not your marching, shouting, red flag waving goons or wannabe student communists. These are the Philby, Burgess, Maclean and Blake types. Embedded, empowered and largely invisible within the establishment. Totalitarian communist ideology is the imperative, “social justice”, “equality” and all the other fluffy, virtue signalling, social democratic bolleaux the tools.

          • The_Mocking_Turtle

            One of your best. Very amusing.

          • Colonel Mustard

            One of your predictables. Smug and sneering as usual.

    • Sean Toddington

      Very funny. Timmy is not being serious here, and he’s quite clever about it. The clues are King Arthur, Tolkein, Britain ending the American slave trade, and banning kitchen knives. But look at the comments. They lapped it up. Excellent!

      • Timmy

        I am very serious. There was no jest.

    • Reborn

      What happened?
      Mass third world immigration+ multiculturalism.

  • Woman at home

    “Britain will become increasingly a patchwork of tribes (‘communities’), united only by paper citizenship,”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flRELYUqmUE

  • The_Mocking_Turtle

    Britain is a fusion of four separate countries and its people have been mongrelised for thousands of years, certainly since travel from the continent by sea was possible. There has never been a definitive homogeneous British race, creed or culture. British identity didn’t exist at all until it was created in 1707 with the Union of England, Wales and Scotland.

    Before Roman times ‘Britain’ was just a geographical entity, and had no political meaning, and no single cultural identity. Arguably this remained generally true until the 17th century, when James I of England and VI of Scotland sought to establish a pan-British monarchy. What people are really moaning about as far as I can see is loss of empire and with it wealth, power and influence on the world stage set to diminish even more once we leave the EU.

    Americans will have to face up to this very trauma when China overtakes the USA as the greatest economic power on earth. Hopefully they will cope with decline better and more realistically than we have.

    • JabbaPapa

      I think you’ll find that the common cultural roots of the British people, warts, wars, and all, did not just suddenly appear ex nihilo in the 17th Century, any more than a common EU-ropean “cultural identity” has not magically popped up like a toadstool in our times.

      What common cultural identity the British may have is far older and hoarier than just some political event or other, in the same way that there is a continuity in Italian identity that has existed since Roman times despite the bewildering political divisions of the country’s History.

      • The_Mocking_Turtle

        I could do with further exegesis. Until fairly recently people in the United Kingdom spoke several different languages, practised different religions, and had very different traditions and histories. (Gaelic and Welsh are still spoken in concert with modern English; Cornish died out completely and now exists only in a reconstructed form.) You will have to outline what you mean by British “cultural identity” and outline how it arose, where it arose, what it means and how it is propagated.

        You seem to be confusing culture with geography.

        Rome and what is now called Italy were the centre of the Roman Empire but Italy as a country only became a unified country in 1861 a full thousand years after the fall of the Roman Empire. Before that Italy consisted of disparate principalities and city-states all with their own unique and colourful art and culture and traditions. The city of Rome existed and still exists in the country called Italy, but as far as I know Italians are not influenced by Roman culture any more than any European country is.

        You will need to spell out what you mean for it to make sense to me.

        • JabbaPapa

          Italy as a country only became a unified country in 1861

          Amazing !!

          I’m so glad you’re here to tell us these things that otherwise we all would be completely ignorant of !!

          • Colonel Mustard

            He’s a smug, sneering leftist “monitor” who pretends he is “centrist” in a poor attempt to validate his tripe. There are one or two just like him on every conservative website. Always exactly the same tedious “superior”, sneering style and same old anglophobe schtick. They probably attend earnest classes on how to peddle the crap.

        • derek

          Exegesis, there is a word you don’t see much outside of academia and theology courses. The culture you are disparaging and refusing to acknowledge is one that has evolved from various traditions and is most obviously present in the concept of common law.
          English common law is the most widespread legal system in the world and combined with it’s derivative, American common law, covers jurisdictions producing over 40% of world GDP and with over 35% of the worlds population living under it’s influence.
          Those are some big numbers coming from a place with no cultural identity.
          I haven’t even started on world-wide sport, the origins of these sports, the numbers of different peoples who play them and the international links and co-operation that result from them.
          Cultural identity is a powerful force as only a cursory reading of Polish history for example, will amply demonstrate.
          An understated cultural identity (even if over-achieving) does not imply it’s absence.

    • Colonel Mustard

      Anglophobe tripe.

  • Busy Mum

    ‘Communities’ – yes, I point this out to all and sundry. Communities = tribes.

    This was amply demonstrated when Teresa May rebuked Donald Trump by saying that the tweets were going to ‘divide our communities’. If this island is inhabited by a collection of communities, we are already divided.

    • Colonel Mustard

      See The_Mocking_Turtle below. The denial of a British homogenity and bleating of “communities” is deliberate in order to justify their vandalism of (mainly) England and silly “diverse” Eurotopia.

  • Sean Toddington

    My friend is a councillor on a council where they have two UKIP councillors. They had 9 but are down to two. One is excluded from most council business because he’s got a history of financial jiggery pokery, and can’t participate in anything to do with money. The other is an earnest if not terribly bright soul. They were discussing a proposal to build affordable housing. He got to his feet and said that he could only support it if the houses didn’t go to … there was a long pause while he tried to find words that wouldn’t land him in not water … at last he managed it … ‘didn’t go to PEOPLE FROM LONDON’. We need more of his type in politics at all levels.

  • Ravenscar

    Excellent post, I have Irish relations and both those who live on this side on the Irish sea and the other lot over there, they’re aghast at our “total surrender” to which I reply – is the IRA running things with the ECB in Dublin?